The book “The CIA as Organized Crime” is a pretty enlightening read for anybody who’d like some more visceral reasons to understand how the democrats serve the same interests
Mrs “no daylight” really gonna go for it?
I love how controversial this is. Lib meter off the charts.
Material analysis, systemic analysis, these processes give clarity: it is a machine that needs to be dismantled.
It’s like when the meme about how just saying nazis should be shunned or punch leads to people coming out saying you have to be nice to nazis
Democrats are better managers of the empire than Republicans. If you want the empire to be weakened or even destroyed, you’d prefer terrible managers.
They’re not even good either, they just are better in media.
This braindeadism would be so funny to watch if America wouldn’t drag everyone else down with them.
Sorry to tell you guys, but your only option in the foreseeable future is to vote for the democrats and pray they prove a tiny bit better. You have nothing else in your hands. Third party votes are political suicide. So is not voting. Even if the Dems are bad, they are not fascists (for now). Pray they don’t become fascists.
Cheers from a place far, far (but not far enough) away.
Even if the Dems are bad, they are not fascists (for now). Pray they don’t become fascists.
Graham Platner literally has a white power tattoo on his chest and has been a paid mercenary for the imperialist projects in Iraq/Afghanistan.
He’s also considered to be the most progressive Democrat in Maine’s election this year.
If all the dems have to do is be 99% as bad as republicans then they’ll always be bad, because republicans also keep getting worse
The Democrats would not do something as self-destructive as invade Iran.
Kamala literally said that Iran is one of the greatest threats… Just look at their foreign policies instead of domestic ones. You’d see that there is not any difference between them at all. Only reason that liberals care about Trump is that he’s mean about it and that’s the extend on which libs think this issue ends on.
Not just that he’s mean, it’s that he doesn’t try to hide how mean he and the usa is. They don’t let them keep the cover over anything
Thinking people are opposed to Trump invading Iran, or opposed to Trump in general because he’s “mean” is misguided at best. If Trump had gone through the correct channels, and gotten congressional approval for the “strategic combat operations” weve been involved in, nobody would have anything to complain about (other than the obvious “no new wars” and higher gas prices, but thats a different topic entirely). Trump acts as though he has absolute power in the seat of the executive, and has unfortunately surrounded himself with loyal cronies that wont tell him no. I dont give a fuck that he’s mean (it isnt even that he is, he honestly acts like a 1st grade playground bully), but I do give a fuck about him following the law, being held accountable when he doesn’t, and that he follows correct etiquette when making decisions that will effect the entire country.
If Trump had gone through the correct channels, and gotten congressional approval for the “strategic combat operations” weve been involved in, nobody would have anything to complain about
I don’t know I think killing hundreds to thousands of innocents is still bad even if the US pedo elite signs off on it collectively.
This is why most of the world hates you btw.
Sadly it would be enough for a lot of Americans, just like the made up bullshit to hit Iraq and Afghanistan
Sorry I shouldve probably said “we’d have less to complain about”. I dont support us getting involved in another war in the middle east, I support that idea EVEN LESS when we start a war in the ME without using the proper channels. And I cant disagree with you there, we constantly get involved in shit around the world that we shouldnt be, and that nobody has asked us to, in the interest of “spreading democracy”.
Acknowledging that they are our greatest threat is not a commitment to do anything. Democratic presidents have always been reactionary to threats. Iran was not doing anything new or different at the time that Trump started bombing the snot out of them.
Democratic presidents have always been reactionary to threats.
They sure are. Like Libya… or Yemen… or Yugoslavia… or…
This situation is literally downstream of a democrat committing genocide in the region. You’re a fool if you think this wasn’t happening under Kamala. Based on what ‘zero difference between me and Biden’ signal she gave during the election do you think she would diverge from this course? Stopping the entity from starting the war? Following the logic of escalation to seek a victory from a position of defeat? Foolish.
Or the tariff insanity
Or invading US states and murdering protesters
You guys only have one joke, and it was barely funny back when it was relevant. Given everything that’s going on right now, it’s just sad.
She could have distanced herself from Biden’s genocide but chose not to
I absolutely agree with you. She was a terrible candidate. But anyone still claiming she was anywhere near as bad as Trump, needs to take a look around.
a diet-genocide is still the same thing as a full-fat-genocide.
She was even campaigning on making the military more lethal and Iran is out biggest enemy
And democrats being the toughest on immigration. They literally ran as republicans, and people are surprised they lost.
We get it, you’re still mad at the commies for not falling in line behind Girlboss Hitler
No. I’m mad that the American left is so politically uneducated that they can’t tell the difference between a Liberal and a literal Fascist. You guys all think they’re the same…even though from a historical standpoint, Fascists hate Liberals almost as much as they hate Socialists.
And it makes me sad that people don’t even realize that it’s the Fascists that want you to think the Liberals are worse than they are…all while convincing the Liberals that Socialists are the ones that want to take away their freedoms.
the difference between a Liberal and a literal Fascist.
Haha, lol, lmao even
Free Palestine
Your good guys literally committed a genocide. You’re a fucking clown.
No. I’m mad that the American left is so politically uneducated that they can’t tell the difference between a Liberal and a literal Fascist.
GUESS THE DIFFERENCE ISN’T FUCKING GENOCIDE
from a historical standpoint
The raw fucking irony of whining about people’s political literacy and then saying this shit.
The amount of guilt by association in this comment would make Israeli propagandists proud. You nailed the total lack of nuance perfectly.
Oh, are israeli propagandists bad or something? Is it a mark on your character to support them or something?
What the fuck do you think the word nuance means, you fucking idiot?
Since the rest of your comment is just smugly talking to yourself, totally nailing the vapid ignorance. “Um actually the people you don’t like would like you because you were mean to me” stupid fucking baby.
We slaughtered a hundred thousand or so but we didn’t say fuck words, it’s very nuanced honey
… from a historical standpoint, Fascists hate Liberals …
they’re the same thing where it matters; you need to go back and study history that isn’t written by a capitalist.
So, do you think it’s just propaganda that the Nazis were anti-liberal? And by extension, do you think that the MAGA movement today is a pro-liberal movement?
The Nazis worked hand in hand with liberals, and after the war liberals helped protect them and use them for the US space program and to lead organizations like NATO.
Oh, wow. So, you don’t distinguish between the collaborators and those who opposed fascism? That’s a very interesting blindspot you have. Convenient, too.
Does that also work for the Soviet Union? They collaborated with the Nazis too, remember?
The liberals only opposed fascism once it was clear that the Nazis were going to attack them as well. Fascists like Batista in Cuba were worked with to the very end, never once opposing them. As for the soviets, they never did collaborate with the Nazis.
What happened was the soviets spent an entire decade trying to form an anti-Nazi alliance, while the liberals were gleefully working with the Nazis. The soviets signed a non-aggression pact on the eve of war to buy time.
Historical illiteracy and false equivalence.
“scratch a liberal, a fascist bleeds”
The democrats are a party of imperialists, just like the republicans. Neither party is capable of changing the US Empire for the better, because both are fully committed to the imperial project. Fascists and liberals actually get along a lot better than you think, because both are fundamentally on the same side of imperialism and capitalism while socialists are on the opposite.
That shows a remarkable lack of understanding about how democracy works. Voters decide who makes up those parties. And Democrats especially are not all the same. Many of them are not imperialists. Unfortunately, many of them are…but it isn’t universal. And the only way to tip the balance against imperialism, is to run leftists for every possible position there is. Up and down the ballot.
But, then you have to actually show up and vote for them when they are in the race. If you don’t…then nothing will ever change.
Really? That’s funny, I seem to remember the DNC canceling the primary last election. Huh. Odd for a party where, “the voters decide who makes up the party”.
No, voters do not decide who makes up the DNC and the GOP. Their donors do. Who you can vote for is already pre-approved by their donors. Secondly, the DNC is an imperialist party, because they all wish to retain the IMF, NATO, capitalism itself, and all that goes into imperialism as the necessary endpoint of late-stage capitalism.
The only way to fight against the US Empire is by overthrowing it. As long as capitalism is maintained, so too will imperialism be maintained. You cannot have late-stage capitalism without imperialism, and the democrats can’t go against their donor-base, which is where they derive their political power from.
So, your only solution is violence? Not solidarity?
I mean, if you think you can achieve anything using the first, without having the second already locked in…you will have cracked the code for universal regime change. I’m pretty sure you could just wave that magic wand and overthrow any government in the world.
So, your only solution is violence? Not solidarity?
You voted for a genocide as a solution instead of having solidarity with it’s victims.
Because you wanted to go back to not caring about politics.
What do you mean by “violence, not solidarity?” Revolution can only come from an organized revolutionary class. The working classes cannot be organized within the boundaries of a capitalist-controlled and dominated party that focuses entirely on legal measures.
Democrats have been just as bad as Republicans when it comes to Central and West Asia. Just because you think people there don’t matter doesn’t mean everyone does
What is sad is that the US political establishment are still pushing the Democrats as an alternative and Americans are too fucking stupid to do anything about it and self police even on alternative platforms like Lemmy
No…what’s actually sad, is that even when there are better alternatives, leftists don’t bother showing up to vote. That’s how we got here. Whenever there’s a chance for us to pull things back to the left…half of us just sit down and whine about how pointless it is to pull.
It is so funny when delusional Americans believe they live in a democracy and not a dictatorship of capital. It isn’t that people didn’t “vote” it is that the government there is structured to make sure that you never threaten capital. Alexis de Toqueville figured this out in the Eighteenth century that the US government is inherently despotic and relies on social norms. The fundamental structure of the constitution is broken and you will never have a “leftist” come to power there, it is literally impossible since voting is fixed during the redistricting phase.
DEMOCRACY IN AMERICA By Alexis De Tocqueville
The frozen republic : how the Constitution is paralyzing democracy by Daniel Lazare
Name the better alternative
Well, there was Bernie Sanders in 2020. But like I said…no one bothered to show up and vote…so we got Biden. And then we got Trump again. Every time there’s a chance to pull things left, we drop the rope.
But like I said…no one bothered to show up and vote…so we got Biden.
That’s not even close to what happened.
The DNC Leadership chose Biden specifically to stop Bernie.
That’s why when Biden was in sixth place going in to Super Tuesday every establishment candidate ahead of him bowed out on the same night and gave him their delegates, pushing him from sixth to first, and Warren stayed in to split the progressive vote and push the “Bernie Bros are sexist creeps” narrative.
The US is not a Democracy, it’s an Oligarchy.
Democrats Now Openly Admit They Pushed Biden to Block Bernie https://share.google/zcegH1ZFBvtMJdShZ
The U.S. is an Oligarchy? The Research, Explained | RepresentUs https://share.google/WHeE7b3nhnAxZ8sSE
Ok. And how did that stop young people from voting? Unless you’re suggesting that those are the reasons they gave themselves for not voting, then none of that should have actually stopped them.
Are you really suggesting that there isn’t a chilling effect on people who want to improve the status quo when they see the party nakedly manipulating the outcome? With this being exactly four years after the DNC nakedly manipulated the system in ways that had since been exhaustively documented, I’d say it massively suppressed the progressive vote, and Warren staying in far too long and splitting that vote before endorsing Biden sealed the deal.
Three election cycles in a row the party has nakedly and unashamedly manipulated things to ensure a donor-friendly candidate. In 2024 there wasn’t even a primary, despite everyone knowing Biden couldn’t handle another campaign.
At this point anyone who finds the status quo unacceptable and still votes for the Democrats is obviously a graduate of the Charlie Brown School of Field Goal Kicks.
not running a pro-genocide candidate to run against another pro-genocide candidate would be a great start.
The best alternative liberal Zionist Bernie Sanders who even if he had received all the votes you wanted would have just been undermined and sabotaged again by the DNC establishment like in 2016. You can’t vote the fascism away. The ruling class is not going to politely expropriate themselves. You should read Luxemburg’s “reform or revolution”.
Bernie isn’t a liberal, dude. And I can’t imagine what you would consider “good enough”, if you don’t think that even trying to drag the window back to the left is worth it.
In 2016, we got a taste. It was a surprise for everyone, just how close we actually came to overturning the status quo. But, you’re right…they had the game rigged. Except by 2020, there were no more super-delegates. And we had four years to get our shit together. All we had to do, was convince even more people to show up.
And we failed. Not only did we not get more to show up…we had way less people show up. The left quit. They sat down and pouted about 2016, instead of standing the fuck up and fighting back.
You can blame it all on “the system” if you want to. You can sit there and cry about how they control everything, and we’re all powerless to do anything about it. If you want to give up, then give up. But you’re forgetting that no matter how much money they can spend on this…votes are still the only thing that matters. If enough people vote the same way, it doesn’t matter how much money they have…we will still win.
But if you let them convince you that your vote doesn’t matter, and that you should just give up and stay home…then they will win. Every. Fucking. Time. And that’s how we got here. They keep winning because we keep giving up.
Bernie is absolutely a liberal. Calling him anything else ignores what he actually proposes. He wants to regulate capital, not expropriate it. He wants to blunt capitalism’s worst edges at home while leaving the imperial core intact. That is social democracy at best, a liberal ideology. His own platform accepts the basic framework of private ownership of the means of production. He seeks to manage the crisis, not resolve its root cause. That is precisely the reformism Luxemburg critiqued a century ago in the work I already recommended. You really should read it.
Electoralism under liberal democracy is not a path to socialism. It is a containment strategy. The ballot box is designed to channel dissent into harmless rituals that leave property relations untouched. You think stacking votes can overcome capital’s structural power. But capital does not rule through votes. It rules through ownership of production, control of credit, domination of media, and monopoly on organised violence. When the vote threatens those foundations, the mask comes off. The courts block, the capital strikes, the media smears, the state represses. This is not conspiracy. It is the normal functioning of the bourgeois state. Expecting otherwise is like expecting a wolf to vote itself vegetarian.
Your entire argument rests on idealist assumptions. You treat consciousness as primary and material conditions as secondary. You think changing minds at the ballot box changes the balance of class forces. That is backwards. Social being determines social consciousness, not the other way around. You mistake the form of democracy for its content. You ignore that the two-party system is a mechanism to limit political competition to factions of capital, not to enable working-class rule. You cite 2016 and 2020 as if they were isolated failures of strategy, not expressions of a system that structurally excludes anti-capitalist politics. You blame the left for “quitting” instead of asking why the electoral arena absorbs and neutralises radical energy every single time. This is not analysis. It is moralising.
I am Chinese, not American. We had our revolution. We broke the bourgeois state and built a system where the vote actually means something because it is embedded in democratic centralism and whole-process people’s democracy, not trapped in a ballot box ritual that changes nothing. These electoralist squabbles about which faction of capital should manage the American empire are none of my concern outside of the theoretical interest I take in educating and engaging in dialogue with comrades in a much different situation.
I know it sounds cliché to say “read theory,” but genuinely, every idealist assumption you are recycling has been academically addressed and refuted for decades.
The DNC is a private corporation and would have chosen Biden anyways
If they did that, Trump would have won the general…just like he did against Hillary. But, they didn’t have to. They managed to successfully convince enough progressives that they could, that people just sat down and stopped fighting.
They managed to successfully convince enough progressives that they could, that people just sat down and stopped fighting
Weird way to say got all but the other progressive candidate to drop out, get behind Biden and have the remaining progressive candidate start attacking Bernie
Why did nobody bother to show up and vote?
Removed by mod
Those dead iranian school childrens blood is on all the hands that sat back and let or even helped trump into the office.
That means that the blood of every dead Gazan is on the hands of everyone who directly voted to enable their slaughter
But oh no gaza
The fact you can say this about a genocide and people not supporting it’s enablers really shows how despicable you are.
The democrats are also war-hawk imperialists, though. Why do you say they wouldn’t have supported bombing Iran? Further, saying “oh no gaza” to brush a genocide under the rug like it’s nothing while you cape for the party that fully supported killing hundreds of thousands of Palestinians is monstrous.
Well, vivid didn’t help. But, I’m assuming also because people just gave up. They threw in the towel, as soon as it looked like Biden was going to consolidate the centrist vote. Polling leading up to super Tuesday, all showed Bernie having strong support among younger voters, and especially students. But none of it actually materialized at the polls themselves.
Why did people give up?
Which leftist alternative did you show up to vote for?
Yeah, we need More female and diverse drone bomber pilots and concentration camp guards!!
The Status Quo vs The Status Quo But Worse is a totally free and fair election, liberal democracy is not just a placeholder for fascism!
