I still don’t believe that distinction actually address the contradiction though and what Lenin says in State and Revolution. The title is literally “The State: A Product of the Irreconcilability of Class Antagonisms” and later “The State: an Instrument for the Exploitation of the Oppressed Class”
How can this state that is a product of the irreconcilability of class antagonisms and an instrument for exploitation of the oppressed class be wielded to do anything else but that? Sure maybe the argument can be made that the bourgeois is the oppressed class in the DoP, but they still control the businesses and enterprises even after a state revolution. I don’t think the world can exist without commerce and it is a fundamental feature of human culture. The Soviet state was never able to break that, at most it transferred a portion of that to the state itself, so was the state then an instrument to exploit itself?
This is why I appreciate people like Rick Wolff and his expanded analysis of the prerequisites of revolution including a robust cooperative economy along with political revolution. I just don’t believe the vanguard state is capable of doing what must be done without a component of non hierarchical syndicalist character and anarchist social revolution as an additive measure to the standard ML take and why I consider myself anarchist leaning.
For clarity, I basically summarized the points of State and Rev.
How can this state that is a product of the irreconcilability of class antagonisms and an instrument for exploitation of the oppressed class be wielded to do anything else but that?
It cannot be, the point is that in socialism, the proletariat exploits the bourgeoisie and gradually appropriates its property.
Sure maybe the argument can be made that the bourgeois is the oppressed class in the DoP, but they still control the businesses and enterprises even after a state revolution.
Correct, but only the secondary and small/medium industries at most, as in China, or practically nothing at all, as in the USSR post-NEP. By holding the commanding heights of the economy, the proletariat holds the economy in general, and has the bourgeoisie’s hands tied.
I don’t think the world can exist without commerce and it is a fundamental feature of human culture. The Soviet state was never able to break that, at most it transferred a portion of that to the state itself, so was the state then an instrument to exploit itself?
The state was in a state of withering. It was not exploiting itself, but the proletariat was in control of the economy, and abolishing class. It wasn’t until revisionism took root that corruption began to start undermining the system.
This is why I appreciate people like Rick Wolff and his expanded analysis of the prerequisites of revolution including a robust cooperative economy along with political revolution. I just don’t believe the vanguard state is capable of doing what must be done without a component of non hierarchical syndicalist character and anarchist social revolution as an additive measure to the standard ML take and why I consider myself anarchist leaning.
I don’t really agree, but that’s fine. Cooperatives can certainly be a part of socialism, for example Huawei is a cooperative, but it isn’t a prerequisite IMO.
I still don’t believe that distinction actually address the contradiction though and what Lenin says in State and Revolution. The title is literally “The State: A Product of the Irreconcilability of Class Antagonisms” and later “The State: an Instrument for the Exploitation of the Oppressed Class”
How can this state that is a product of the irreconcilability of class antagonisms and an instrument for exploitation of the oppressed class be wielded to do anything else but that? Sure maybe the argument can be made that the bourgeois is the oppressed class in the DoP, but they still control the businesses and enterprises even after a state revolution. I don’t think the world can exist without commerce and it is a fundamental feature of human culture. The Soviet state was never able to break that, at most it transferred a portion of that to the state itself, so was the state then an instrument to exploit itself?
This is why I appreciate people like Rick Wolff and his expanded analysis of the prerequisites of revolution including a robust cooperative economy along with political revolution. I just don’t believe the vanguard state is capable of doing what must be done without a component of non hierarchical syndicalist character and anarchist social revolution as an additive measure to the standard ML take and why I consider myself anarchist leaning.
For clarity, I basically summarized the points of State and Rev.
It cannot be, the point is that in socialism, the proletariat exploits the bourgeoisie and gradually appropriates its property.
Correct, but only the secondary and small/medium industries at most, as in China, or practically nothing at all, as in the USSR post-NEP. By holding the commanding heights of the economy, the proletariat holds the economy in general, and has the bourgeoisie’s hands tied.
The state was in a state of withering. It was not exploiting itself, but the proletariat was in control of the economy, and abolishing class. It wasn’t until revisionism took root that corruption began to start undermining the system.
I don’t really agree, but that’s fine. Cooperatives can certainly be a part of socialism, for example Huawei is a cooperative, but it isn’t a prerequisite IMO.